Messages In This Digest (19 Messages)
- 1a.
- "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Ozpagan
- 1b.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 1c.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Mark Dunn
- 1d.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 1e.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Mark S Hepworth
- 1f.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Ozpagan
- 1g.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 1h.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 1i.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Bri King
- 1j.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Mark S Hepworth
- 1k.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Ozpagan
- 1l.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Nisaba Merrieweather
- 1m.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 1n.
- Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!" From: Caroline Tully
- 2a.
- Re: Book Plug From: Caroline Tully
- 3.1.
- Re: Its Hallowe'en south of the border.. From: Caroline Tully
- 3.2.
- Re: Its Hallowe'en south of the border.. From: Caroline Tully
- 4a.
- Re: Oh for joy, for joy, 'tis census time again From: Mark S Hepworth
- 5.1.
- Census From: Caroline Tully
Messages
- 1a.
-
"I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Ozpagan" ozpagan@ozpagan.com wwwozpagancom
Wed Aug 3, 2011 9:41 pm (PDT)
The Australian census is being conducted next week.
On Tuesday 9th August Australian pagans will have an opportunity to use the census to help identify the collective number of people who are part of the Nature Religions.
As you probably already know the Australian Bureau of Statistics uses the census as practical way to obtain information on not only how many people there are in Australia, but what they do and how they live. It's an important step in having Pagans recognised.
"I'm Pagan, count me in!"
That's the catch-cry of the Pagan Dash organisation. They suggest "...Pagan is just a subcategory of Nature Religions. The way to have it made into an umbrella term is to use the Pagan-method." By this they are suggesting we use "Pagan" as a category and then add a descriptive word of what type of Pagan if you wish. Eg, Pagan-Witch, or Pagan-Shaman, etc.
I think the real benefit of identifying our religious/spiritual orientation is in having our many diverse forms of Pagan spirituality counted in a meaningful way.
The WitchesWorkshop has a large and diverse number of Australian pagans involved through it's Yahoo eGroup with 2155 members, while our Facebook Group and Page have a combine membership of some 2830. There is obviously a lot of crossover of membership, but even 2000 members would be a sizable number of people to add into the mix of Pagans in the census to be counted next Tuesday.
vinum sabbati,
Tim
- 1b.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:18 pm (PDT)
Hmm, as I'm in Cyprus, not back until the 11 Aug, when does the Census have to be 'done' by? I haven't kept up with any news in Australia. Do they let us keep it for a while and then give it back?
I really like filling in forms - yeah, I'm weird - not any old forms, but forms that are survey-like, especially if they involve questions about religion.
So I am anxious to participate in the Census.. Can anyone tell me what the deal is with how long we get to keep it (is it even on peper)? Otherwise I'll have to get someone at home to fill it in for me.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Ozpagan" <ozpagan@...com > wrote:
>
> The Australian census is being conducted next week.
> On Tuesday 9th August Australian pagans will have an opportunity to use the census to help identify the collective number of people who are part of the Nature Religions.
> As you probably already know the Australian Bureau of Statistics uses the census as practical way to obtain information on not only how many people there are in Australia, but what they do and how they live. It's an important step in having Pagans recognised.
>
> "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
> That's the catch-cry of the Pagan Dash organisation. They suggest "...Pagan is just a subcategory of Nature Religions. The way to have it made into an umbrella term is to use the Pagan-method." By this they are suggesting we use "Pagan" as a category and then add a descriptive word of what type of Pagan if you wish. Eg, Pagan-Witch, or Pagan-Shaman, etc.
> I think the real benefit of identifying our religious/spiritual orientation is in having our many diverse forms of Pagan spirituality counted in a meaningful way.
>
> The WitchesWorkshop has a large and diverse number of Australian pagans involved through it's Yahoo eGroup with 2155 members, while our Facebook Group and Page have a combine membership of some 2830. There is obviously a lot of crossover of membership, but even 2000 members would be a sizable number of people to add into the mix of Pagans in the census to be counted next Tuesday.
>
> vinum sabbati,
> Tim
>
- 1c.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Mark Dunn" bratwulf2@bigpond.com blackwulf2
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:22 pm (PDT)
Caroline,
I believe you can do it online.
Mark
----- Original Message -----
From: Caroline Tully
To: WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2011 3:18 PM
Subject: [WitchesWorkshop] Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Hmm, as I'm in Cyprus, not back until the 11 Aug, when does the Census have to be 'done' by? I haven't kept up with any news in Australia. Do they let us keep it for a while and then give it back?
I really like filling in forms - yeah, I'm weird - not any old forms, but forms that are survey-like, especially if they involve questions about religion.
So I am anxious to participate in the Census.. Can anyone tell me what the deal is with how long we get to keep it (is it even on peper)? Otherwise I'll have to get someone at home to fill it in for me.
~Caroline.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1d.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:28 pm (PDT)
Where? Is there some big fat website?\
Thanx.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Mark Dunn" <bratwulf2@.com ..> wrote:
>
> Caroline,
>
> I believe you can do it online.
>
> Mark
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Caroline Tully
> To: WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. com
> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2011 3:18 PM
> Subject: [WitchesWorkshop] Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
>
>
>
> Hmm, as I'm in Cyprus, not back until the 11 Aug, when does the Census have to be 'done' by? I haven't kept up with any news in Australia. Do they let us keep it for a while and then give it back?
>
> I really like filling in forms - yeah, I'm weird - not any old forms, but forms that are survey-like, especially if they involve questions about religion.
>
> So I am anxious to participate in the Census.. Can anyone tell me what the deal is with how long we get to keep it (is it even on peper)? Otherwise I'll have to get someone at home to fill it in for me.
>
> ~Caroline.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
- 1e.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Mark S Hepworth" mits@parraletic.net mitswitchlist
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:34 pm (PDT)
Firstly Tim, thank you for the push. We have been working on the Pagan -
campaign for a while now and it is great to see the general pagan
community coming on board and supporting it. We really hope to make
another big jump in numbers like we did from 1996 - 2001 but as long as
it is steady or a rises I will be happy.
Since the www.pagandash.org.au website went live in early April we have
been gradually accumulating "Shares" on facebook via the Share link in
the left coloumn of the site. This allows people to share the site and
their message about it on facebook. We have had as I write this 998
shares so far. I am refreshing at regular intervals as I want to see it
click over to 1000.
I think 1000 shares is a great start, and I hope we will get many more
in the coming week before the census on Tuesday. We had only 450 last
week so we are seeing a huge jump. The great thing about this method as
well is that no matter how many friends you have, the all see the post
in thier most recent stream on facebook and can act on it, a simple call
to action, some reshare the link, and I have seen on my facebook 3 or 4
friends listed as sharing the Pagandash.org.au link within a few hours
of each other.
We hope that a large number of Australia Pagans will, Stand up and Be
counted in the 2011 census.
Caroline, the Census is to be completed on the 9th of August. There is a
posability that the census collector will leave your form and eCensus
card on the doorstep for you to complete.
The eCensus site went live on the 28th of July and Census collection
continues until the 28th of August.
Regards,
Mark Hepworth.
On 4/08/2011 3:22 PM, Mark Dunn wrote:
>
> Caroline,
>
> I believe you can do it online.
>
> Mark
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Caroline Tully
> To: WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. com
> <mailto:WitchesWorkshop%40yahoogrou ps.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2011 3:18 PM
> Subject: [WitchesWorkshop] Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
>
> Hmm, as I'm in Cyprus, not back until the 11 Aug, when does the Census
> have to be 'done' by? I haven't kept up with any news in Australia. Do
> they let us keep it for a while and then give it back?
>
> I really like filling in forms - yeah, I'm weird - not any old forms,
> but forms that are survey-like, especially if they involve questions
> about religion.
>
> So I am anxious to participate in the Census.. Can anyone tell me what
> the deal is with how long we get to keep it (is it even on peper)?
> Otherwise I'll have to get someone at home to fill it in for me.
>
> ~Caroline.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1f.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Ozpagan" ozpagan@ozpagan.com wwwozpagancom
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:03 pm (PDT)
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Caroline Tully" <heliade@...com > wrote:
>
> Where? Is there some big fat website?\
>
> Thanx.
Try this link Caroline.
...only five days to go!
http://www.abs.gov.au/census
vinum sabbati,
Tim
- 1g.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:13 pm (PDT)
Thank you.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Ozpagan" <ozpagan@...com > wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Caroline Tully" <heliade@> wrote:com
> >
> > Where? Is there some big fat website?\
> >
> > Thanx.
>
>
> Try this link Caroline.
> ...only five days to go!
>
> http://www.abs.gov.au/census
>
> vinum sabbati,
> Tim
>
- 1h.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:16 pm (PDT)
Re: the eCensus card... will I need some sort of login number? Why do I need the card? I' d better word up my people back at home to watch out for it....
~Caroline.
> Caroline, the Census is to be completed on the 9th of August. There is a
> posability that the census collector will leave your form and eCensus
> card on the doorstep for you to complete.
- 1i.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Bri King" scarlettheartt@gmail.com bri_berrie
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:18 pm (PDT)
Yes there is an envelope they give you with a number inside it and you need
it to complete the online questions. Not sure if they will leave the manual
form or the online envelope at your home if there is no one there. I am
pretty sure you have to be there in person to get the online envelope as
they ask you if you want to fill in the form or do it online and then give
you the appropriate paperwork.
Bri
On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Caroline Tully <heliade@bigpond.com > wrote:
> Re: the eCensus card... will I need some sort of login number? Why do I
> need the card? I' d better word up my people back at home to watch out for
> it....
>
> ~Caroline.
>
>
> > Caroline, the Census is to be completed on the 9th of August. There is a
> > posability that the census collector will leave your form and eCensus
> > card on the doorstep for you to complete.
>
>
>
>
> --------------------- --------- ------
>
> ____________________ ooo)(0({O})0) (ooo_____ _________ ______
>
> Witches Workshop hold regular workshops see
> http://www.witchesworkshop.com/ Circle/circle_ workshop. html
>
> Keep up to date via our WitchesWorshop Facebook Page:
> http://www.facebook.com/pages/ Sydney-Australia /WitchesWorkshop /135651219624
>
> WitchesWorkshop and Witch Camp Australia also run camps
> several times a year - check out our websites for updates.
> http://www.witchcampaustralia. org.au
> http://www.witchesworkshop.com
> _____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
>
> The WitchesWorkshop egroup holds the expectation that a
> tolerant and respectful dialogue be strived for in our
> communication with other pagans, witches magicians, et al.
> Members are encouraged to challenge anyone not adhering
> to these principles & to notify owner.
>
> info@witchesworkshop.com
> _____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
--
BA, BSW, Grad Dip Soc Sci
M. Counselling
Pomegranate Counselling & Consultancy
www.fatlotofgood.org.au
ScarlettHeartt Photography
www.redbubble.com/people/ scarlettheartt
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1j.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Mark S Hepworth" mits@parraletic.net mitswitchlist
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:25 pm (PDT)
Hi Bri,
That is what I thought as well, but I read a blog today saying that the
census collector left the form and an ecensus envelope for the person.
Either way though, as I have written on the Dash site, the census
collector has to return to pick up the paper form. If you are there when
the collector comes and you tell them you are going to do eCensus, the
Census collector does not return, that is a point that has been widely
publicised.
Regards,
Mark
On 4/08/2011 4:18 PM, Bri King wrote:
>
> Yes there is an envelope they give you with a number inside it and you
> need
> it to complete the online questions. Not sure if they will leave the
> manual
> form or the online envelope at your home if there is no one there. I am
> pretty sure you have to be there in person to get the online envelope as
> they ask you if you want to fill in the form or do it online and then give
> you the appropriate paperwork.
>
> Bri
>
> On Thu, Aug 4, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Caroline Tully <heliade@bigpond.com
> <mailto:heliade%40bigpond. com>> wrote:
>
> > Re: the eCensus card... will I need some sort of login number? Why do I
> > need the card? I' d better word up my people back at home to watch
> out for
> > it....
> >
> > ~Caroline.
> >
> >
> > > Caroline, the Census is to be completed on the 9th of August.
> There is a
> > > posability that the census collector will leave your form and eCensus
> > > card on the doorstep for you to complete.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------- --------- ------
> >
> > ____________________ ooo)(0({O})0) (ooo_____ _________ ______
> >
> > Witches Workshop hold regular workshops see
> > http://www.witchesworkshop.com/ Circle/circle_ workshop. html
> >
> > Keep up to date via our WitchesWorshop Facebook Page:
> >
> http://www.facebook.com/pages/ Sydney-Australia /WitchesWorkshop /135651219624
> >
> > WitchesWorkshop and Witch Camp Australia also run camps
> > several times a year - check out our websites for updates.
> > http://www.witchcampaustralia. org.au
> > http://www.witchesworkshop.com
> > _____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
> >
> > The WitchesWorkshop egroup holds the expectation that a
> > tolerant and respectful dialogue be strived for in our
> > communication with other pagans, witches magicians, et al.
> > Members are encouraged to challenge anyone not adhering
> > to these principles & to notify owner.
> >
> > info@witchesworkshop.com <mailto:info%40witchesworksho p.com>
> > _____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
>
> BA, BSW, Grad Dip Soc Sci
> M. Counselling
>
> Pomegranate Counselling & Consultancy
>
> www.fatlotofgood.org.au
>
> ScarlettHeartt Photography
> www.redbubble.com/people/ scarlettheartt
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1k.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Ozpagan" ozpagan@ozpagan.com wwwozpagancom
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:28 pm (PDT)
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , Mark S Hepworth <mits@...> wrote:com
>
> Firstly Tim, thank you for the push. We have been working on the Pagan -
> campaign for a while now and it is great to see the general pagan
> community coming on board and supporting it. We really hope to make
> another big jump in numbers like we did from 1996 - 2001 but as long as
> it is steady or a rises I will be happy.
Hi Mark and WW,
I have been identifying myself as a Pagan-Witch in the Australian census since the early 1970s, and would never consider doing otherwise. I have been a little surprised and disturbed by a number of pagan acquaintances who have admitted they placed things like "Church of England" and "Catholic" down in past census.
While I haven't written them off as 'pagans', I really feel now is a time to use this opportunity to try gain legitimate recognition and be counted among the many orthodox faiths.
Some people may have concerns over standing-out in crowd; while it's never been much of a concern to me - I was already publicly known as a Witch. The concern about personal privacy is nevertheless real and the census paper does provides for this with an 'opt-out' question (No. 60) so that any information that might identify you will not be kept. Great foresight on the part of the ABS.
I'd love to get more feedback from members about their views and how they will mark the census paper?
vinum sabbati,
"Pagan-Witch" Tim
- 1l.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Nisaba Merrieweather" nisaba.merrieweather@hotmail.com nisaba_merrieweather
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:59 pm (PDT)
G'dday.
To: WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. com
From: ozpagan@ozpagan.com
Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:03:08 +0000
Subject: [WitchesWorkshop] Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Caroline Tully" <heliade@...com > wrote:
>
> Where? Is there some big fat website?\ There's a cvatch. It's not about national identity, or even where you usually live. It's strictly about where you will be spending one particular Tuesday night. If you happen to be O/s on that day, even if only for one night, by the rules you cannot take part. Nisaba
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1m.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Thu Aug 4, 2011 3:36 am (PDT)
I will say Pagan-Witch.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Ozpagan" <ozpagan@...com > wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , Mark S Hepworth <mits@> wrote:com
> >
> > Firstly Tim, thank you for the push. We have been working on the Pagan -
> > campaign for a while now and it is great to see the general pagan
> > community coming on board and supporting it. We really hope to make
> > another big jump in numbers like we did from 1996 - 2001 but as long as
> > it is steady or a rises I will be happy.
>
>
> Hi Mark and WW,
>
> I have been identifying myself as a Pagan-Witch in the Australian census since the early 1970s, and would never consider doing otherwise. I have been a little surprised and disturbed by a number of pagan acquaintances who have admitted they placed things like "Church of England" and "Catholic" down in past census.
>
> While I haven't written them off as 'pagans', I really feel now is a time to use this opportunity to try gain legitimate recognition and be counted among the many orthodox faiths.
>
> Some people may have concerns over standing-out in crowd; while it's never been much of a concern to me - I was already publicly known as a Witch. The concern about personal privacy is nevertheless real and the census paper does provides for this with an 'opt-out' question (No. 60) so that any information that might identify you will not be kept. Great foresight on the part of the ABS.
>
> I'd love to get more feedback from members about their views and how they will mark the census paper?
>
> vinum sabbati,
> "Pagan-Witch" Tim
>
- 1n.
-
Re: "I'm Pagan, count me in!"
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Thu Aug 4, 2011 3:42 am (PDT)
I haven't looked at the news - from Australia, and barely from anywhere else except the occasional big news in Israel or Cyprus - for two months, so I'm finding all this Census information useful.
As I said... I like filling in forms.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , Mark S Hepworth <mits@...> wrote:com
>
> Hi Bri,
>
> That is what I thought as well, but I read a blog today saying that the
> census collector left the form and an ecensus envelope for the person.
> Either way though, as I have written on the Dash site, the census
> collector has to return to pick up the paper form. If you are there when
> the collector comes and you tell them you are going to do eCensus, the
> Census collector does not return, that is a point that has been widely
> publicised.
>
> Regards,
> Mark
>
> On 4/08/2011 4:18 PM, Bri King wrote:
> >
> > Yes there is an envelope they give you with a number inside it and you
> > need
> > it to complete the online questions. Not sure if they will leave the
> > manual
> > form or the online envelope at your home if there is no one there. I am
> > pretty sure you have to be there in person to get the online envelope as
> > they ask you if you want to fill in the form or do it online and then give
> > you the appropriate paperwork.
> >
> > Bri
- 2a.
-
Re: Book Plug
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:21 pm (PDT)
Hi Frances, yeah, Bibliotheca Alexandrina *are* doing some interesting books. Maybe there's a project for someone here - another anthology in conjunction with them?
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "frances_tdm" <frances@...com > wrote:
>
> Congrats Caroline on being included in this anthology.
>
> I have a number of anthologies produced by Bibliotheca Alexandrina (all rather good I must say) as well as Tess's "Whisper of Stone" so I personally would be interested in getting my hands on a copy of "Anointed".
>
> BB - Frances
>
> --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Caroline Tully" <heliade@> wrote:com
> >
> > Sabbat Tidings, I'm just plugging a new anthology that I have two chapter in. ~from Caroline (in Cyprus).
> >
> > Anointed: A Devotional Anthology for the Deities of the Near and Middle East. Edited by Tess Dawson and the Editorial Board of the Bibliotheca Alexandrina
> >
> > http://neosalexandria.org/bibliothe ca-alexandrina/ anointed- a-devotional- anthology- for-the-deities- of-the-near- and-middle- east/
- 3.1.
-
Re: Its Hallowe'en south of the border..
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:23 pm (PDT)
Both the Roman Diana and Juno also have epithets involving 'Lucifer[a]' - and of course there's Lucifer in Aradia, Gospel of the Witches.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "frances_tdm" <frances@...com > wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Ozpagan" <ozpagan@> wrote:com
> >
> > It's an interest subject this anthropology of witches; and you don't have to look too far into the past before you stumble across Witches in Europe with pet familiars named Lucifer and Satan. You get the feeling that these witches either had very funny sense of humour or else they enjoyed waving a red-flag at their persecutors. This practice still seems popular with some witches because I've numerous times come across witches' cats named Satan.
> >
>
> * hands up for being guilty of Lucifer being included in one of my rites - tis mentioned in my book so when that is available, you can read all about it (should you so wish).
>
> BB - Frances
>
- 3.2.
-
Re: Its Hallowe'en south of the border..
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Wed Aug 3, 2011 10:27 pm (PDT)
Yes, and 'Satan' wasn't the 'devil' until *after* the New Testament either. Before that, in the Hebrew Bible he was an 'accuser' - see 'Deities and Demons in the Bible' (ed) Karel Van Der Toorn, for more info on that. Apparently it was in the New Testament that 'satan' - or 'ha satan' became 'Satan' the absolute opposite of Jesus Christ.
~Caroline.
--- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "frances_tdm" <frances@...com > wrote:
>
> Thanks for that wee gem of enlightenment, Matthieu.
>
> Being a non-Christian, the myths contained within the Bible really don't shape my practices.
>
> I have however read Leland's "Gospel of the Witches" where Lucifer is described as being Diana's brother who was "the god of the Sun and of the Moon, the god of Light (Splendor)" who she coupled with to create the divine child Aradia.
>
> Our friends at wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ ) indiate that the use of the name "Lucifer" for the devil stems from a particular interpretation of Isaiah 14:3–20, a passage that does not speak of any fallen angel but of the defeat of a particular Babylonian King, to whom it gives a title that refers to what in English is called the Day Star or Morning Star (in Latin, lucifer).[2] In 2 Peter 1:19 and elsewhere, the same Latin word lucifer is used to refer to the Morning Star, with no relation to the devil. It is only in post-New Testament times that the Latin word Lucifer was used as a name for the devil, both in religious writing and in fiction, especially when referring to him prior to his fall from Heaven.Lucifer
>
> Then again, it is Wikipedia so who knows ...
>
> --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , Matthieu Morelle <lucifervulus_com sa_kage@> wrote:
> >
> > Just so you know Lucifer is an angel responsible for reporting the sins of mankind to god. People got sick of him and demoted him to a demon... Then blaming him for pain and torment he because synonymous with Satan. Lucifer is Latin from the adjective lucis (meaning light) and the verb ferre (meaning to carry or to bare) making Lucifer mean light barer.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: frances_tdm
> > Sent: Tuesday, 2 August 2011 8:11
> > To: WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. com
> > Subject: [WitchesWorkshop] Re: Its Hallowe'en south of the border..
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In WitchesWorkshop@yahoogroups. , "Ozpagan" <ozpagan@> wrote:com
> > >
> > > It's an interest subject this anthropology of witches; and you don't have to look too far into the past before you stumble across Witches in Europe with pet familiars named Lucifer and Satan. You get the feeling that these witches either had very funny sense of humour or else they enjoyed waving a red-flag at their persecutors. This practice still seems popular with some witches because I've numerous times come across witches' cats named Satan.
> > >
> >
> > * hands up for being guilty of Lucifer being included in one of my rites - tis mentioned in my book so when that is available, you can read all about it (should you so wish).
> >
> > BB - Frances
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
- 4a.
-
Re: Oh for joy, for joy, 'tis census time again
Posted by: "Mark S Hepworth" mits@parraletic.net mitswitchlist
Wed Aug 3, 2011 11:52 pm (PDT)
<Snipped to save bandwidth>
>
> You know Mark it isn't just the "Pagan" issue that pisses me off big
> time with the census: Their proposal that it is virtually just to
> count heads is bloody minded nonsense! They already have the
> statistics re births,deaths and immigration and migration. Simple sums
> would give them all the answers they need or indeed have any right to
> have. I shall once again put my devious mind to work avoiding filling
> out their impertinent bloody form.. and avoid incurring any penalty
> for failure to do so.
>
> Thanks for your reply ..Bill.
>
Hi Bill,
I can understand that, I have spoken to a few census collectors who told
me that was their issue with the census and that is why the got involved
to find out more.
You are right, the register of Births, Death and Marriages as well as
the Immigration department would give you a number for population, but
then you are talking about linking two goverment departments, which
gives me the willies to begin with, wasn't that why we rejected the
Australia card, as the State Roads departments and Medicare would be linked?
The other information in the Census is who lives in the area, because I
don't think Birth's Death and marriages collates were you move to
between the 3 events. That data might be taken from the roads system, or
passports department, or even medicare, linking a few more goverment
agencies. Then there is the question of the household income, so you
also start to throw in the Tax department into the equation.
Local goverments (Councils and the like) get their funding based on
Census Data, now we all get rates notices and I am sure you could say,
that local councils could provide that information to the commonwealth
(as in a number) to get appropriate funding. The problem I have with
that, is watching the behaviour of local councils recently, I can't
honestly say that a large number of them wound'nt jack up their numbers
to get more money. Also when you pay rates you are paying per house, but
that doesn't tell you how many people live there or what services might
be required for those residents.
This is why the census happens, to keep these compeating interests
apart. Also why the census is anonymous, as if they goverment had all
this data linked, well I for one would not be happy.
For the dash campagin we focus on religion, religion is on the census to
assist the local goverment areas to know if they have the right type of
religous services for their constitants. Having been involved with
census stuff from March this year, working on the Dash campaign, I have
seen an e-mail doing the rounds, that is now turning up on facebook
telling Australian's to write a religion on their census, even if it is
the one you were raised under because "1,000,000" Australian musliums
will put down their faith, and you may end up with a mosque next door to
your house! This is partially true, as funding for local religous groups
is based on census data. Having said that, I think funding a stone
circle in a public park is going to be a big ask. Also gotta appluade
the peddelers of fear for making something that is so small a thing, a
issue of discrimination.
Maybe the recent talk about eCensus has inspired you, tell the census
collector your going to do eCensus, you get an eCensus card but never do
the eCensus.
Regards,
Mark Hepworth
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 5.1.
-
Census
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Thu Aug 4, 2011 4:00 am (PDT)
No wonder Pagans are practically un-countable, with messy categories like the below. As for being countable, yes, I do think it is useful. Numbers are useful to argue with - and they need to be updated. ~Caroline.
http://www.pagandash.org.au/ content/faq
Current Categories
Q. What are the specific Australian Bureau of statistics (ABS) / Australian Standard Classification of Religious Groups (ASCRG) groups for Pagans?
A. The ABS, using the best of their information they could gather from the responses given to the 1996 census have grouped Pagans with other Nature based religions.
6130 Nature Religions
6131 Animism
6132 Druidism / Druids
6133 Paganism
6134 Pantheism / Neolithic Pantheism / Scientific Pantheist
6135 Wiccan/Witchcraft / Wiccan / Witchcraft / Gardnerian / Alexandrian
6139 Nature Religions, nec
These include
Asatru (Nordic)
American Native Church
Brother of Bacchus
Church of All Worlds
Eagle Hearth
Earth Goddess
Earth Mother
Earth Nature
Folkvang Hearth
Gaia
Gaian
Goddess
Inca Sun Worshipper
Lesbian Feminist Goddess Worship
Lughian (Old Celtic)
Moon Worship
Mother Earth
Mother Nature
Naturalist
Nature Worship
Nature, nai
Old Gaelic
Planet Earth
Shamanist
Sun Worshipper
The Asatru Kindred of Asia
The Assembly of the Troth
Rune-Net
Voodoo
PAGANdash hopes that we can re-arrange this grouping with your responses to see Pagan Religions grouped together with new grouping and subgroup system.
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Witches Workshop hold regular workshops see
http://www.witchesworkshop.com/Circle/circle_workshop.html
Keep up to date via our WitchesWorshop Facebook Page:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Sydney-Australia/WitchesWorkshop/135651219624
WitchesWorkshop and Witch Camp Australia also run camps
several times a year - check out our websites for updates.
http://www.witchcampaustralia.org.au
http://www.witchesworkshop.com
___________________________________________________________
The WitchesWorkshop egroup holds the expectation that a
tolerant and respectful dialogue be strived for in our
communication with other pagans, witches magicians, et al.
Members are encouraged to challenge anyone not adhering
to these principles & to notify owner.
info@witchesworkshop.com
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