Messages In This Digest (6 Messages)
- 1.1.
- Re: Witchcraft in Germany From: scott_bisseker
- 1.2.
- Re: Witchcraft in Germany From: scott_bisseker
- 1.3.
- Re: Witchcraft in Germany From: Sue Gray
- 1.4.
- Re: Witchcraft in Germany From: scott_bisseker
- 2.
- Survey on Pagan Attitudes toward Elders From: Caroline Tully
- 3.
- Witchfather - A Life of Gerald Gardner From: Caroline Tully
Messages
- 1.1.
-
Re: Witchcraft in Germany
Posted by: "scott_bisseker" nu_scott@hotmail.com scott_bisseker
Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:09 pm (PST)
Greetings CB
Sorry about being tardy but I am having PC dramas at the moment.
> Correct me if I'm mistaken, but did you just say that "being nice" is a new, novel, alien approach according to "your forbears" ?
Well ... while that is CLOSE no not exactly - that would be skewing the intent of my words really.
When I said: ""our" collective "forebears" held such views as "ally before prospective enemy" I meant it pretty much as it reads really but to be precise about the meaning I had in mind .. I will break it down and explain.
I said our "collective" (plural and obviously setting the tone as a generalisation) "forebears" (in inverted commas because I don't specifically mean genetic OR "spiritual" exclusively) and "ally before prospective enemy" to make clear the idea that friendship is a thing that is something that is proved over time. It is more likely that outsiders be considered possible threats until such time as they show good faith.
So .. again ... kind of but not really.
Of course I will point out though (or admit as some would prefer that to read! lol) that several of those who came before me in the lines to which I have belonged were most certainly aptly described as you put it .. but I was referring to a wider collective than them.
Subsisto
Scott
- 1.2.
-
Re: Witchcraft in Germany
Posted by: "scott_bisseker" nu_scott@hotmail.com scott_bisseker
Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:18 pm (PST)
Hey Bill,
Yes indeed .. in fact I had pretty much that very experience the first time I went to one of those public meetings years ago.
There I was going as a representative of my then group. Waiting with a friend in a place that I did not know for someone I did not know to go to a place I had never been but that I knew would be filled with people whose sentiments I wouldn't share.
The first thing they did was rush up to me with arms outstretched teeth out! Lol They were somewhat taken aback when I had recoiled with a stick diagonal across between us in a defensive stance. lol
Fabulous ol Darren comes hurtling across to prevent the immediate colllision (cultural and otherwise) explaining at a million miles an hour to me that this was our contact and to him that not everyone has the same social rules! lol
Needless to say that day it was explained to several people that not everyone finds physical contact with people they don't know acceptable, that it is not always appropriate - sometime for reasons other than gender and that the idea that "we all just run around and hug" because that is "nice" can get you injured pretty quickly outside of certain pagan/occult circles! lol
Subsisto
Scott
- 1.3.
-
Re: Witchcraft in Germany
Posted by: "Sue Gray" bastkittycat@yahoo.com bastkittycat
Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:04 pm (PST)
Lol!
I really dislike that about the pagan community. The hugging the and kissy, kissy that goes on when you meet up, especially from people I haven't met before.
I find it a bit invasive, and sometimes out and out hypocritical. I think too much of the new agey mentality has kicked in to modern paganism.
While I'm here, I would just like to have a bit of a bitch about how much Buddhist practices have also influenced a lot of Paganism so much so that you are frowned upon in some circles if you are a meat eater.
Gods forbid if you don't believe in the 3 fold law and are quite happy to curse someone who has pissed you off!
Sue
People who don't like cats were most likely mice In a former life.
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 1.4.
-
Re: Witchcraft in Germany
Posted by: "scott_bisseker" nu_scott@hotmail.com scott_bisseker
Thu Jan 12, 2012 5:39 pm (PST)
Greetings Sue,
lol I like how you think.
Here are a couple of thoughts i had reading your post.
> I really dislike that about the pagan community. The hugging the and kissy, kissy that goes on when you meet up, especially from people I haven't met before. I find it a bit invasive, and sometimes out and out hypocritical.
The way I was taught, when you embark on this path in a real way you immerse yourself. In many ways you become the conduit for the things you work with (and not just on special dates!) - in essence you become magical. Curse is when you think ill and blessing when you think well of someone/thing. Because of this, (and the fact that theoretically one contemplates the rammifications of this deeply and has the greatest of respect for it) contact of ANY kind with ANY other in this respect is considered (and should be considered!) a mark of trust to some degree. Some people you have no contact with, some you might correspond with, talk with, meet openly, meet at your place or theirs and so on. This certainly follows through to physical contact of any kind which is considered a gift of trust. How you greeted another showed who you were, who they were where you were in relation to eachother and so on. How you shook hands even what words you used .. so from that background the idea of just wrapping one's body to another even if you don't know them is .... well let's say "inadvisable" to say nothing of foolish, rude and naive. lol
>I think too much of the new agey mentality has kicked in to modern paganism.
I agree heartily but do try to remind myself that I have benefitted from some of it - even some bits I consider sheer lunacy. Obviously some days I do better than others on that score.
> While I'm here, I would just like to have a bit of a bitch about how much Buddhist practices have also influenced a lot of Paganism
I lived down the road as a kid from the Chenrezig Institute - long before it got money, when you had to get there along a dirt road and if it rained you'd probably get stranded there and seeing the way certain things have been bastardised (Karma immediately springs to mind) so again I agree. How anyone gets the idea that Karma means don't act as your essential nature moves you I don't know - but then again I don't see how anyone can make sense of Karma without Dharma so I suppose that is inevitable.
> so much so that you are frowned upon in some circles if you are a meat eater.
*G* I am fond of observing that if someone hadn't been eatin MEAT we wouldn't have the brain form and capacity to be able to have philosophical debates about the moral or spiritual ramifications of eating meat I the first place. For the record I am very comfortable with it and only really object to vegetarianism when it is implied that I should be one. I don't say that everyone should be a canivore (despite being often of teh opine that a three course meal means three different kinds of meat!) so often feel slighted when someone suggests I should become a herbivore.
> Gods forbid if you don't believe in the 3 fold law and are quite happy to curse someone who has pissed you off!
It used to be said that a witch had to be two handed - dare I suggest such equates with being even handed? *BG* Simply put if you can't blight you can't bless and for many reasons (including some here in this post) obviously I champion such views.
I have no problem with some trying to achieve such top shelf ideals - however unachievable they may be. I am all for people shootin fer the moon in terms of their own morals in fact I find it laudable; BUT there is a none too complimentary word for thinking that everyone shares one's own views and standards. I can think of several for those who think one *should* do so - the first of which being "inattentive".
Hell I even tried that once a long time ago. I made my promises of non harm and then broke them. I felt quite bad for a bit but then spotted the problem. I found myself thinking that if I would do the same again and honestly felt it justified - perhaps I should really be saying sorry not for breaking the promise but rather for being silly enough to promise something I was clearly not meant to promise in the first place! lol
Subsisto
Scott
- 2.
-
Survey on Pagan Attitudes toward Elders
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Thu Jan 12, 2012 4:57 pm (PST)
From..
http://blog.chasclifton. com/?p=3718
Survey on Pagan Attitudes toward Elders
Posted on January 10, 2012, 5:12 PM, by Chas Clifton.
If you might be considered a Pagan elder, have opinions on who should be
considered an elder - not specific people, but people holding what qualities
- or think that there should or should not be councils of elders, help a
researcher by <http://www.surveymonkey.com/ > taking this survey.s/SZQY69X
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
- 3.
-
Witchfather - A Life of Gerald Gardner
Posted by: "Caroline Tully" heliade@bigpond.com willowitch2001
Thu Jan 12, 2012 6:40 pm (PST)
Forwarding….
Subject: [thewicca] Witchfather - A Life of Gerald Gardner
You might like to know that my new biography of Gerald Gardner is now
available in electronic (pdf) format. Details are given below. The printed
version will follow shortly.
New eBook releases by Philip Heselton through Thoth Publications
Witchfather
A Life of Gerald Gardner
Volume 1. Into the Witch Cult, 330 Pages
Volume 2. From Witch Cult to Wicca, 426 pages
eBooks priced at only £6.99 each are available now to read from
www.thoth.co.uk
Printed books available soon
From the author of the highly acclaimed "Wiccan Roots", this is the first
full-length biography of Gerald Brosseau Gardner (1884-1964) - a very
personal tale of the man who single-handedly brought about the revival of
witchcraft in England in the mid 20th Century.
From his birth into an old family of wealthy Liverpool merchants, through an
unconventional upbringing by his flamboyant governess in the resorts of the
Mediterranean and Madeira, it tells how, having taught himself to read, his
life was changed by finding a book on spiritualism.
During a working life as a tea and rubber planter in Ceylon, Borneo and
Malaya, he came to know the native people and was invited to their secret
rituals.
But it was only on his retirement to England, settling on the edge of the
New Forest in Hampshire, that destiny took him firmly by the hand. Through
various twists and turns involving naturist clubs and a strange esoteric
theatre, he became friends with a group of people who eventually revealed
their true identity - they were members of a surviving witch coven.
One evening in 1939, as the hounds of war were being unleashed, he was
initiated into the witch cult by these people, who called themselves 'the
Wica'. Gardner was overwhelmed by the experience and was determined that the
witch cult should survive.
This book chronicles his efforts over the remaining quarter century of his
life to ensure not only that it survived but that it would become the
significant player on the world religious stage that it now is "the only
religion that England has ever given the world", in the words of Ronald
Hutton, Professor of History at the University of Bristol, who calls it "a
very fine book: humane, intelligent, compassionate, shrewd, and based upon a
colossal amount of primary research".
Born in 1946, Philip Heselton is a geographer and retired local government
officer who has written extensively on Earth Mysteries and our spiritual
relationship with the landscape. He has also carried out extensive research
into the story of the modern witchcraft revival, chronicled in his books,
"Wiccan Roots" and "Gerald Gardner and the Cauldron of Inspiration".
Hutton has described him as being "the most interesting, valuable and
enjoyable author who has yet written on what is becoming one of the greatest
riddles in the history of modern religion: the origins of pagan witchcraft.
… Nobody has ever done more than Philip Heselton to reveal the world of
magic, paganism, naturism and faerie that lay behind the garden gates of
inter-war English suburban villas; and perhaps only he could have done it at
all."
eBooks priced at only £6.99 each are available now to read from
www.thoth.co.uk
Printed books available soon
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Witches Workshop hold regular workshops see
http://www.witchesworkshop.com/Circle/circle_workshop.html
Keep up to date via our WitchesWorshop Facebook Page:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Sydney-Australia/WitchesWorkshop/135651219624
WitchesWorkshop and Witch Camp Australia also run camps
several times a year - check out our websites for updates.
http://www.witchcampaustralia.org.au
http://www.witchesworkshop.com
___________________________________________________________
The WitchesWorkshop egroup holds the expectation that a
tolerant and respectful dialogue be strived for in our
communication with other pagans, witches magicians, et al.
Members are encouraged to challenge anyone not adhering
to these principles & to notify owner.
info@witchesworkshop.com
___________________________________________________________
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