Messages In This Digest (15 Messages)
- 1.
- Devotion for Gaia From: Gary Reese
- 2.
- H P Lovecraft entities From: Gary Reese
- 3.
- Jack-o-Lantern From: Gary Reese
- 4.
- All Hallow's Eve From: Gary Reese
- 5.1.
- Thought for the Day From: Lady Nightshayde
- 5.2.
- Re: Thought for the Day From: David
- 6a.
- Re: Info on tools and postures please. From: Carol
- 6b.
- Re: Info on tools and postures please. From: Lady Nightshayde
- 6c.
- Re: Info on tools and postures please. From: Carol
- 6d.
- Re: Info on tools and postures please. From: Fran Wolfe-Johnson
- 7.
- (no subject) From: dean elder
- 8.
- Names for Healing Circle, 9/7/2011, 12:00 am From: 13Witches@yahoogroups.com
- 9.1.
- Today's Quote From: Lady Nightshayde
- 9.2.
- Re: Today's Quote From: peves38@yahoo.com
- 10.
- (no subject) From: Diana Lewis
Messages
- 1.
-
Devotion for Gaia
Posted by: "Gary Reese" hyperreal69@yahoo.com hyperreal69
Tue Sep 6, 2011 11:18 am (PDT)
Here is a devotion to Gaia...Our Mother!
the link is at the bottom...
Hymnos Magna Mater
O Universal Mother, who dost keep
>>From everlasting thy foundations deep,
>>Eldest of things, Great Earth, I sing of thee!
>>All shapes that have their dwelling in the sea,
>>All things that fly, or on the ground divine
>>Live, move, and there are nourished... these are thine;
>>These from thy wealth thou dost sustain; from thee
>>Fair babes are born, and fruits on every tree
>>Hang ripe and large, revered Divinity!
>>The life of mortal men beneath thy sway
>>Is held; thy power both gives and takes away!
>>Happy are they whom thy mild favors nourish;
>>All things unstinted round them grow and fluorish.
>>For them, endures the life-sustaining field
>>Its load of harvest, and their cattle yield
>>Large increase, and their house with wealth is filled.
>>Such honoured dwell in cities fair and free,
>>The homes of lovely women, prosperously;
>>Their sons exult in youth's new budding gladness,
>>And their fresh daughters free from care or sadness,
>>With bloom-inwoven dance and happy song,
>>On the soft flowers the meadow-grass among,
>>Leap round them sporting... such delights by thee
>>Are given, rich Power, revered Divinity.
>>Mother of Gods, thou Wife of starry Heaven,
>>Farewell! be thou propitious, and be given
>>A happy life for this brief melody,
>>Nor thou nor other songs shall unremembered be.
>>
>>(Text: Homeric Hymn, translation G. B.Shelley)
>
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>
>Oh Allmother Nature, Magna Mater,
>Firstborn, Unique, Mightiest,
>Unsurpassed, singular and absoulte
>power,
>
>thou hast created the universe after thy will,
>The elements serve thy command,
>thou hast given life to everything out of thy womb,
>
>The shape of the earth is thy body,
>Existence is filled with thy universal power,
>Empress of life that is in all and everything,
>Mistress of the earth through thee we live
>and to thy womb we return in time
>
>Thou that is all,
>is in all
>and we all are thee.
>
>Personal Addition
>Hail to thee, Empress of life,
>To thee I pray, look upon me with mercy
>I ask thee to send light and help
>to those I love
>I ask thee to send light and help
>to those who are in need
>Mother of mercy, Mother of doom
>I knee down before thy feet
>and pray for thy guidance
>through the coming times
>In thy hands I lay my life,
>my pure essence is thine,
>my being nothing without thee.
>(Text: Roibin (me)
>Magna Mater
>
>Oh Divine Mother! Creator of all atoms and light!
>Thou hast sung the Eternal Chord
>That brought all reality into being,
>And sustained it with thy Mighty Bow.
>Huntress, who gives and harvests life,
>We praise Thee for the Festal Board
>in golden Thargelión.
>From eternity to eternity,
>Thou art ever the Immaculate, All-perfection,
>Omniscient, Most Brilliant Orb of Beauty.
>Grateful are we, humble handmaidens dependent
>on thy ever-flowing Milk of Sustenance,
>Matter and Spirit.
>Thou art the Aion of Truth, Radiant,
>a Fountain of Justice,
>She who turns the Wheel and Weaves the Tapestry of the Cosmos.
>Envelop us always in Your Loving Embrace,
>To drink of your Mercy. Blessed Be
>Julia Cybele Cachia / 5 Aug 90
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>http://inanna.virtualave. net/mothershrine .html
>
>
>
>Bright Blessings,
>Gae
>Gae
- 2.
-
H P Lovecraft entities
Posted by: "Gary Reese" hyperreal69@yahoo.com hyperreal69
Tue Sep 6, 2011 11:25 am (PDT)
Here is a little something I picked up and found interesting. Copied w/ permission.
Gae
H P Lovecraft
H P LovecraftThe stories of Howard Phillip Lovecraft have provided us with a rich mythology of strange deities, among them Azathoth, C'thulu, Yog Sothoth and Nyarlathotep. He brought fame to the book known as the Necronomicon or Book of Dead Names.
Speculation could lead us to beleive that much of Lovecrafts mythos is based on the real Necronomicon, which Lovecraft had access to, due to his father's involvement in Egyptian Freemasonry. Of course, the theory is that his dad went mad from reading the Necronomicon and died mad.
Azathoth and NyarlathotepAzathoth is described as the blind mindless god who rules from a throne of chaos at the centre of the universe.
Nyarlathotep is his messenger, the crawling chaos, the black man. He is supposedly 7 or 8 feet tall, with skin as black as the dark void of Azathoths throne.
Pete Carroll gives a different description of Azathoth in Liber Kaos & The Psychonomicon. Here we learn that it was originally a term used by the alchemists to mean an increase in azoth, or increasing etheric (morphic) fields in contemporary terms. Supposedly H P Lovecraft called this egregore the Blind Mad God at the Centre of Chaos out of fear. The god is only blind in the sense that it can only be invoked into someone with their eyes closed or blindfolded, and will vanish upon opening. It is only mad in that it communicates only in telepathy while the operator performs psycho-babble glossolalia.
Kenneth Grant links Azathoth with the Qabalistic Sphere of Chokmah. This links Azathoth with Adam Kadmon, and hence Baphomet.
See the stories The Dreams in the Witch-House, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath, The Other Gods and the fragment Azathoth.
Yog Sothoth and Nodens
Yog Sothoth Yog Sothoth is a strange deity that sits outside of space and time. He is completely impartial and amoral. According to Kenneth Grant, he is linked with the Qabalistic Sphere of Daath. This links him with certain deities such as Set.
H P Lovecraft often makes cryptical references to "Deep and hoary Nodens".
Grant calls Nodens the god of the Abyss. Since Daath is the Abyss, this links Nodens with Yog Sothoth.
See the stories The Case of Charles Dexter Ward, The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath, and especially The Silver Key and Through the gates of the Silver Key.
Cthulu
Cthulu, apparantly is a Mile high monster, whose image is somewhat a cross between a human, a dragon and an octopus. Reality distorts around him and space becomes non-euclidian.
Grant links Cthulu with Qabalistic Binah.
See the stories At the Mountians of Madness, and especially The Call of Cthulu.
Further Reading
Pete Carroll Liber Kaos & the Psychonomicon ISBN 0-87728-742-2
Kenneth Grant Hecate's Fountain ISBN 1-871438-96-9
George Hay (ed), Colin Wilson (introduction by) The Necronomicon, The Book of Dead Names ISBN 1-871438-16-0
.
- 3.
-
Jack-o-Lantern
Posted by: "Gary Reese" hyperreal69@yahoo.com hyperreal69
Tue Sep 6, 2011 12:06 pm (PDT)
I will keep looking for more!
Gae
found this @
pumpkinnook.com/facts/ jack.htm
History of the Jack O'Lantern
The Irish brought the tradition of the Jack O'Lantern to America. But, the original Jack O'Lantern was not a pumpkin.The Jack O'Lantern legend goes back hundreds of years in Irish History. As the story goes, Stingy Jack was a miserable, old drunk who liked to play tricks on everyone: family, friends, his mother and even the Devil himself. One day, he tricked the Devil into climbing up an apple tree. Once the Devil climbed up the apple tree, Stingy Jack hurriedly placed crosses around the trunk of the tree. The Devil was then unable to get down the tree. Stingy Jack made the Devil promise him not to take his soul when he died. Once the devil promised not to take his soul, Stingy Jack removed the crosses and let the Devil down.
Many years later, when Jack finally died, he went to the pearly gates of Heaven and was told by Saint Peter that he was too mean and too cruel, and had led a miserable and worthless life on earth. He was not allowed to enter heaven. He then went down to Hell and the Devil. The Devil kept his promise and would not allow him to enter Hell. Now Jack was scared and had nowhere to go but to wander about forever in the darkness between heaven and hell. He asked the Devil how he could leave as there was no light. The Devil tossed him an ember from the flames of Hell to help him light his way. Jack placed the ember in a hollowed out Turnip, one of his favorite foods which he always carried around with him whenever he could steal one. For that day onward, Stingy Jack roamed the earth without a resting place, lighting his way as he went with his "Jack O'Lantern".
On all Hallow's eve, the Irish hollowed out Turnips, rutabagas, gourds, potatoes and beets. They placed a light in them to ward off evil spirits and keep Stingy Jack away. These were the original Jack O'Lanterns. In the 1800's a couple of waves of Irish immigrants came to America. The Irish immigrants quickly discovered that Pumpkins were bigger and easier to carve out. So they used pumpkins for Jack O'Lanterns.
_____________________ _________ __
Other Tales of Stingy Jack:
JACK-of-the-TURNIP According to legend, the Turnip was the predecessor of the Halloween pumpkin. How's that for roots?
- 4.
-
All Hallow's Eve
Posted by: "Gary Reese" hyperreal69@yahoo.com hyperreal69
Tue Sep 6, 2011 12:20 pm (PDT)
Source loc.gov Blessings...Gae
Halloween
The Fantasy and Folklore of All Hallows
Jack Santino
Halloween had its beginnings in an ancient, pre-Christian Celtic festival of the dead. The Celtic peoples, who were once found all over Europe, divided the year by four major holidays. According to their calendar, the year began on a day corresponding to November 1st on our present calendar. The date marked the beginning of winter. Since they were pastoral people, it was a time when cattle and sheep had to be moved to closer pastures and all livestock had to be secured for the winter months. Crops were harvested and stored. The date marked both an ending and a beginning in an eternal cycle.
The festival observed at this time was called Samhain (pronounced Sah-ween). It was the biggest and most significant holiday of the Celtic year. The Celts believed that at the time of Samhain, more so than any other time of the year, the ghosts of the dead were able to mingle with the living, because at Samhain the souls of those who had died during the year traveled into the otherworld. People gathered to sacrifice animals, fruits, and vegetables. They also lit bonfires in honor of the dead, to aid them on their journey, and to keep them away from the living. On that day all manner of beings were abroad: ghosts, fairies, and demons--all part of the dark and dread.
Samhain became the Halloween we are familiar with when Christian missionaries attempted to change the religious practices of the Celtic people. In the early centuries of the first millennium A.D., before missionaries such as St. Patrick and St. Columcille converted them to Christianity, the Celts practiced an elaborate religion through their priestly caste, the Druids, who were priests, poets, scientists and scholars all at once. As religious leaders, ritual specialists, and bearers of learning, the Druids were not unlike the very missionaries and monks who were to Christianize their people and brand them evil devil worshippers.
As a result of their efforts to wipe out "pagan" holidays, such as Samhain, the Christians succeeded in effecting major transformations in it. In 601 A.D. Pope Gregory the First issued a now famous edict to his missionaries concerning the native beliefs and customs of the peoples he hoped to convert. Rather than try to obliterate native peoples' customs and beliefs, the pope instructed his missionaries to use them: if a group of people worshipped a tree, rather than cut it down, he advised them to consecrate it to Christ and allow its continued worship.
In terms of spreading Christianity, this was a brilliant concept and it became a basic approach used in Catholic missionary work. Church holy days were purposely set to coincide with native holy days. Christmas, for instance, was assigned the arbitrary date of December 25th because it corresponded with the mid-winter celebration of many peoples. Likewise, St. John's Day was set on the summer solstice.
Samhain, with its emphasis on the supernatural, was decidedly pagan. While missionaries identified their holy days with those observed by the Celts, they branded the earlier religion's supernatural deities as evil, and associated them with the devil. As representatives of the rival religion, Druids were considered evil worshippers of devilish or demonic gods and spirits. The Celtic underworld inevitably became identified with the Christian Hell.
The effects of this policy were to diminish but not totally eradicate the beliefs in the traditional gods. Celtic belief in supernatural creatures persisted, while the church made deliberate attempts to define them as being not merely dangerous, but malicious. Followers of the old religion went into hiding and were branded as witches.
The Christian feast of All Saints was assigned to November 1st. The day honored every Christian saint, especially those that did not otherwise have a special day devoted to them. This feast day was meant to substitute for Samhain, to draw the devotion of the Celtic peoples, and, finally, to replace it forever. That did not happen, but the traditional Celtic deities diminished in status, becoming fairies or leprechauns of more recent traditions.
The old beliefs associated with Samhain never died out entirely. The powerful symbolism of the traveling dead was too strong, and perhaps too basic to the human psyche, to be satisfied with the new, more abstract Catholic feast honoring saints. Recognizing that something that would subsume the original energy of Samhain was necessary, the church tried again to supplant it with a Christian feast day in the 9th century. This time it established November 2nd as All Souls Day--a day when the living prayed for the souls of all the dead. But, once again, the practice of retaining traditional customs while attempting to redefine them had a sustaining effect: the traditional beliefs and customs lived on, in new guises.
All Saints Day, otherwise known as All Hallows (hallowed means sanctified or holy), continued the ancient Celtic traditions. The evening prior to the day was the time of the most intense activity, both human and supernatural. People continued to celebrate All Hallows Eve as a time of the wandering dead, but the supernatural beings were now thought to be evil. The folk continued to propitiate those spirits (and their masked impersonators) by setting out gifts of food and drink. Subsequently, All Hallows Eve became Hallow Evening, which became Hallowe'en--an ancient Celtic, pre-Christian New Year's Day in contemporary dress.
Many supernatural creatures became associated with All Hallows. In Ireland fairies were numbered among the legendary creatures who roamed on Halloween. An old folk ballad called "Allison Gross" tells the story of how the fairy queen saved a man from a witch's spell on Halloween.
O Allison Gross, that lives in yon tower
the ugliest witch int he North Country...
She's turned me into an ugly worm
and gard me toddle around a tree...
But as it fell out last Hallow even
When the seely [fairy] court was riding by,
the Queen lighted down on a gowany bank
Not far from the tree where I wont to lie...
She's change me again to my own proper shape
And I no more toddle about the tree.
In old England cakes were made for the wandering souls, and people went "a' soulin'" for these "soul cakes." Halloween, a time of magic, also became a day of divination, with a host of magical beliefs: for instance, if persons hold a mirror on Halloween and walk backwards down the stairs to the basement, the face that appears in the mirror will be their next lover.
Virtually all present Halloween traditions can be traced to the ancient Celtic day of the dead. Halloween is a holiday of many mysterious customs, but each one has a history, or at least a story behind it. The wearing of costumes, for instance, and roaming from door to door demanding treats can be traced to the Celtic period and the first few centuries of the Christian era, when it was thought that the souls of the dead were out and around, along with fairies, witches, and demons. Offerings of food and drink were left out to placate them. As the centuries wore on, people began dressing like these dreadful creatures, performing antics in exchange for food and drink. This practice is called mumming, from which the practice of trick-or-treating evolved. To this day, witches, ghosts, and skeleton figures of the dead are among the favorite disguises. Halloween also retains some features that harken back to the original harvest holiday of Samhain, such as the
customs of bobbing for apples and carving vegetables, as well as the fruits, nuts, and spices cider associated with the day.
Today Halloween is becoming once again and adult holiday or masquerade, like mardi Gras. Men and women in every disguise imaginable are taking to the streets of big American cities and parading past grinningly carved, candlelit jack o'lanterns, re- enacting customs with a lengthy pedigree. Their masked antics challenge, mock, tease, and appease the dread forces of the night, of the soul, and of the otherworld that becomes our world on this night of reversible possibilities, inverted roles, and transcendency. In so doing, they are reaffirming death and its place as a part of life in an exhilarating celebration of a holy and magic evening.
September 1982
Go to:
* A Selected Bibliography on Halloween and Related Topics
- 5.1.
-
Thought for the Day
Posted by: "Lady Nightshayde" LadyNightshayde9@aol.com nightshayde99
Tue Sep 6, 2011 12:24 pm (PDT)
Here's a thought for the day:
A new study found out that having money and good looks does not make you happy. On the other hand, being broke and ugly is no day at the beach either.
The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
Love Each Day,
Lady Nightshayde
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/13Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/Whispering Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/MagickalMe als/
http://groups.yahoo/group/ NightshaydesNews
- 5.2.
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Re: Thought for the Day
Posted by: "David" david@n1ib.com chipbandit99
Tue Sep 6, 2011 12:44 pm (PDT)
you are right having money and good looks really is a curse where as
being ugly and broke is so liberating so please feel free to curse me
with money and good looks I will take that punishment fir what ever I
have done
Sent from David's iPhone
On Sep 6, 2011, at 2:23 PM, Lady Nightshayde
<LadyNightshayde9@aol.com > wrote:
>
>
> Here's a thought for the day:
>
> A new study found out that having money and good looks does not make
> you happy. On the other hand, being broke and ugly is no day at the
> beach either.
>
>
> The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
>
> Love Each Day,
> Lady Nightshayde
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/13Witches/
> http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/Whispering Witches/
> http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/MagickalMe als/
> http://groups.yahoo/group/ NightshaydesNews
>
>
>
- 6a.
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Re: Info on tools and postures please.
Posted by: "Carol" hawkshill13@yahoo.com hawkshill13
Tue Sep 6, 2011 3:31 pm (PDT)
Keelty Sage,
When I started in the Craft over a decade ago, I treated it as a science experiment, since much of the Craft is about bending and utilizing energies. I was not certain if I believed in the spiritual aspects yet; those beliefs came later. I had only a few books then, and knew only one other witch. She was a High Priestess--still, most of what I learned I learned on my own. I recorded the results in a journal, doing my best to remain objective, and to apply, as far as I was able, the scientific method. Because of how I approached the Craft, I am confident now in my beliefs, and confident that my beliefs are organically my own--rather than things simply imparted to me. I am a solitary witch, and happily so; belonging to an order, or a coven, would not be compatible with the person that I am. Wherever your own spiritual path leads you, I urge you to ask questions regardless, to keep an open and active mind--as Lady Nightshayde said, curiosity is a good thing.
Moreover, after spending years in a particular Christian sect, I have learned that it can sometimes be a bad sign when questions are discouraged or when knowledge, or access to knowledge, is based on hierarchy. My church was immensely hierarchical, and those higher in the hierarchy claimed to have higher spiritual access; unfortunately, as I later learned, those who ranked in this hierarchy were incredibly corrupt, and did not practice even the rudiments of what they taught. Though I did not rank at all in the hierarchy, when I was a practicing Christian, I tried my very best to live by my faith--not only as far as fulfilling the tenets were concerned, but I tried to practice as honestly as I could, with as pure a heart. At any rate, I recognized later that questions in my church were dismissed, discouraged, and treated with disdain not for the benefit of the congregants, but because secrecy and silence was needed for the hierarchy to exist as it was, for the corruption to go unnoticed.
I am not saying this is the case everywhere, but it can be the case--and certainly, if your teacher is being derisive or dismissive of your questions, I might suggest you leave that teacher anyways--not for their benefit, but for yours. Perhaps you will decide that studying under a teacher is best for you; perhaps not. However, in that instance, you owe it to yourself to find a teacher that provides you with enough information so that you are not left frustrated, wondering what to do, and how to act and practice, but provides you with a more complete picture of the Craft, so that your own beliefs can be more whole. In the meantime, I hope you read a lot, study, practice, and continue to ask questions!
BB,
Hawkshill
--- In 13Witches@yahoogroups.com , Keelty_Sage <walksalone2004@...> wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> If I remember correctly this is a group of sometimes very serious folks that know their craft well. I am studying Gardnerian Wicca with a teacher. My problem is I am having a hard time finding a good source for exactly what tools are used and how they are used. I would also like to know more about the god and goddess postures. I have just recently became aware of them and didn't know there was a difference before this week. One source on the internet tells how the pentacle altar tile is used to charge the ritual tools before a ritual, but when I ask a man that was suppose to be Wiccan he told me they don't use them. When I ask him then just what ritual tools they did use he told me that only the initates were privileged with that information. I am sitting there thinking, okay so what is a student suppose to use for tools in the meantime.
>
> I have studied Celtic Greenwitch with a teacher for 8 1/2 months, then we had a communication problem and it all feel apart. I have recently started with a Gardnerian teacher and I think she assumes I know the tools already even though I had told her about all the conflicting information I have experienced. Since I still feel like I don't have the correct information I would greatly appreicate any information on the subject of tools and postures used in Gardnerian Wicca.
>
> Keelty Sage
>
>
- 6b.
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Re: Info on tools and postures please.
Posted by: "Lady Nightshayde" LadyNightshayde9@aol.com nightshayde99
Tue Sep 6, 2011 3:56 pm (PDT)
At any rate, I recognized later that questions in my church were dismissed, discouraged, and treated with disdain not for the benefit of the congregants, but because secrecy and silence was needed for the hierarchy to exist as it was, for the corruption to go unnoticed.
This is exactly what I mean about coven leaders who behave this way. When a seeker is looked down on with disdain because they inquire about something, then it is time to leave, even if it means leaving a tradition you thought you wanted to be part of. I experienced it firsthand with the Gardnerian coven I joined. True, there are "secrets" that should be kept within the coven, but when the knowledge is kept from someone IN the coven, like being told "you don't need to know that," or "it's the way we've always done things" if you ask why. Things should be learned in a particular order, but as simple a question as asking about tools should be answered.
I had a friend several years ago who was studying with a Gardnerian coven in South Florida, and she was told she couldn't even associate with members of my coven. We haven't spoken since she told me that.
There is a fine line between secrecy for the group's sake and secrecy because you are The Great Awesome All-Knowing Priestess of the Secret Society of the Tradition of the Never Telling Anyone Below Tenth Degree Anything.
The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
Love Each Day,
Lady Nightshayde
- 6c.
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Re: Info on tools and postures please.
Posted by: "Carol" hawkshill13@yahoo.com hawkshill13
Tue Sep 6, 2011 4:44 pm (PDT)
I agree with this! And I think that a person, no matter what path they choose to follow, with whom, or under whom, should feel more fulfilled than frustrated. And should somehow be enabled to interact more positively with the world, rather than be cut off from it. I am sorry about your friend, though--but thank you for bringing me a much-needed laugh.
BB,
Hawkshill
--- In 13Witches@yahoogroups.com , Lady Nightshayde <LadyNightshayde9@...> wrote:
>
>
> There is a fine line between secrecy for the group's sake and secrecy because you are The Great Awesome All-Knowing Priestess of the Secret Society of the Tradition of the Never Telling Anyone Below Tenth Degree Anything.
>
>
> The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
>
>
> Love Each Day,
> Lady Nightshayde
>
- 6d.
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Re: Info on tools and postures please.
Posted by: "Fran Wolfe-Johnson" tygermoonfoxx@gmail.com tygermoonfoxx
Tue Sep 6, 2011 7:22 pm (PDT)
On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 6:56 PM, Lady Nightshayde
<LadyNightshayde9@aol.com >wrote:
with the Gardnerian coven I joined. True, there are "secrets" that should
> be kept within the coven, but when the knowledge is kept from someone IN the
> coven, like being told "you don't need to know that," or "it's the way we've
> always done things" if you ask why. Things should be learned in a
> particular order, but as simple a question as asking about tools should be
> answered.
>
That's what I meant. She hadn't made it clear (at least to me) that they
hadn't bothered explaining those things. For the inexperienced, those
postures and gestures can psychically wipe and ruin a dedicant. I would
liken it to a type of sensory overload. The REASONS she wasn't being given
the information ought to have been made clear, as should the reasons for not
having tools. I was told, at least, why (that tools were given at first
degree initiation and THEN you begin learning about and handling them...some
of the older BTWs have very specific designs for their tools and specific
ways of dedicating them. To receive one of these sets is to be welcomed into
the family, kind of like being given an heirloom at a wedding).
I still think she ought to go back to her teacher and talk to her. The
lines of communication need to be kept open. She should also find out who
presides over her teacher and if answers are not forthcoming contact THAT
person, explain the problem, and receive answers. It's her right as a seeker
and specifically under any of the BTWs. "You're not ready for that and you
need to do this first/learn this first/complete this first" is a legitimate
response. The comments like the ones above are not. A good teacher will
explain, "We do it this way because..."
Either way, she ought to look closely at her involvement with this group.
If they refuse to give answers, then the Gardnerian connection may not even
be legitimate (did she ask for lineage references? That too is information a
seeker is entitled to; the person should be able to tell them 1) who trained
them 2) contacts for that teacher 3) who runs the coven with which they are
associated 4) who bestowed the founding of a coven on that person. Most
Gardnerians, if they're legitimate, can trace their lines either back to one
of the American founders or to Gardner himself). I'm ever wary of a teacher
who just says "You don't need to know that" or "That's oathbound". I could
see telling someone that if she were wanting to see the documentation, but
general references and answers SHOULD have been given.
I had a friend several years ago who was studying with a Gardnerian coven in
> South Florida, and she was told she couldn't even associate with members of
> my coven. We haven't spoken since she told me that.
>
The Southe Florida Gardnerians are an exclusive lot and insist on no outside
contacts. It's one of the reasons husband and myself were ultimately
separated from the Georgian contingent in the same area. They inter-trained
with those Gardnerians and shared the expense of renting Sabbat locations.
When they cracked down, we were ousted. The Gardnerian priestess did not
want to deal with a disabled covener.
She may not be entitled to the specific information she's asking for --- I
myself would not give that information to someone who is relatively new to
those kinds of efforts, not without seeing what they could do and what they
understood first --- but she's entitled to the reasons why she's not to know
and she's entitled to know the lineage connection.
I suspect, now, that there isn't one. There's just no reason not to explain
why the postures are restricted to initiatory degrees and no reason not to
simply tell her that tools will be provided and she will learn about them
when she receives them.
(And I apologize for the unclarity of my previous post ---is that even a
word? LOL --- as it was late and I was not using my brain fully. Hopefully
this makes more sense)
--
"Whenever the pressure of our complex city life thins my blood and numbs
my brain, I seek relief in the trail; and when I hear the coyote wailing to
the yellow dawn, my cares fall from me - I am happy."
-- Hamlin Garland
Fran Wolfe-Johnson (WalkerTXKitty)
FoxHeart Acres, FL
http://www.myhappytrails.net
- 7.
-
(no subject)
Posted by: "dean elder" deanancient@yahoo.com deanancient
Tue Sep 6, 2011 5:00 pm (PDT)
<a tabindex="1" title="" name="qnmypotpfy" href="http://kingofusagoestojapan. ">http://kingofusagoecom/blogs/ skins/NaturalRem edyBlogTheme/ images/invtamazo n.htm stojapan. </a>com/blogs/ skins/NaturalRem edyBlogTheme/ images/invtamazo n.htm
- 8.
-
Names for Healing Circle, 9/7/2011, 12:00 am
Posted by: "13Witches@yahoogroups.com" 13Witches@yahoogroups.com
Tue Sep 6, 2011 8:43 pm (PDT)
Reminder from: 13Witches Yahoo! Group
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/13Witches/ cal
Names for Healing Circle
Wednesday September 7, 2011
All Day
(This event repeats every week.)
Notes:
If you have any requests for healing energies or candle-lighting please send them in for the Healing Circle, which is done every Wednesday Night.
All Rights Reserved
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Yahoo! Inc.
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http://docs.yahoo.com/ info/terms/
- 9.1.
-
Today's Quote
Posted by: "Lady Nightshayde" LadyNightshayde9@aol.com nightshayde99
Tue Sep 6, 2011 8:57 pm (PDT)
Nothing is so common as the wish to be remarkable.
~William Shakespeare
The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
Love Each Day,
Lady Nightshayde
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/13Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/Whispering Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/MagickalMe als/
http://groups.yahoo/group/ NightshaydesNews
- 9.2.
-
Re: Today's Quote
Posted by: "peves38@yahoo.com" peves38@yahoo.com peves38
Wed Sep 7, 2011 2:38 am (PDT)
remarkable quote have U send,i only wish i could find internal quietness and
peace...sal...
Sent via DROID on Verizon Wireless
-----Original message-----
From: Lady Nightshayde <LadyNightshayde9@aol.com >
To: 13Witches@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, Sep 7, 2011 03:58:43 GMT+00:00
Subject: [13Witches] Today's Quote
Nothing is so common as the wish to be remarkable.
~William Shakespeare
The light of a hundred stars cannot equal the light of the Moon.
Love Each Day,
Lady Nightshayde
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/13Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/Whispering Witches/
http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/MagickalMe als/
http://groups.yahoo/group/ NightshaydesNews
- 10.
-
(no subject)
Posted by: "Diana Lewis" ladydiana4869@yahoo.com ladydiana4869
Tue Sep 6, 2011 9:01 pm (PDT)
<a tabindex="1" title="" name="teuobwiylw" href="http://ecclesia413.com/wp-content/ ">http://ecclesia413.themes/StandardT heme_20/timthumb /cache/iettasama mazon.htm com/wp-content/ </a>themes/StandardT heme_20/timthumb /cache/iettasama mazon.htm
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